[RealJustme]

Just like doing away with the IRS and going with flat taxes why not do away with health care insurance?

Cut out the middle men and doctors can cut the number of people they need, costs would go way down. People just pay for their own medical care. That way if they want that massage they feel they need, they pay for it instead of the other guy. No insurance companies saying that's not covered, you want it you got it, just pay for it instead of sending your money to the insurance company.

No IRS and no health care insurance companies, no one to blame for not getting what you feel you want or need. Of course you would still need car insurance to cover the other guy's costs if your at fault, but that's a different matter. You pay as you go for your health care under my plan.

[johnforbes]

With all the argument about Obamacare, nobody has any idea what the real market might be for any medical procedure.

What does it cost to take care of x problem? Nobody knows because market forces are filtered through a bunch of billing to health insurance outfits.

A doctor recently persuaded me to have an EKG because I'd never had one and, he said, it was "free" under my insurance. Never mind zero cardiac symptoms. Never mind decades of running outdoors. Naturally, the EKG was normal and a waste of money.

[RealJustme]

According to the State Association of Hospitals , California's public health system is "on the brink of collapse." In Los Angeles County, patients can wait four days for a hospital bed and up to two years for gallbladder surgery. Sixty percent of the County's patients are not U.S. citizens. More than half are here illegally, none of them have insurance or pay for their treatment. Illegal immigrants aren't pursued for payment since collection efforts would be more than any recovery, plus since they have no documentation they aren't reported to any credit agency or collection agency for none payment. Many legal Hispanic citizens have caught on and often obtain free medical treatment pretending to be undocumented immigrants, often just to avoid co-pays.

Many Californians blame the immigrants for the rising medical costs and difficulty in obtaining timely care but undocumented immigrant Yolanda Hernandez, argues [Americans] have enough money to pay for insurance, they make good money unfortunately, we don't. Like it or not, America has to provide everyone medical care, we may not be citizens but we are residents."

Isn't it amazing that a legal citizen "must" pay by law but illegals are given free rides by our medical system.

[snakeoil]

My father had a small heart attack in January. He had to be transported to a hospital that is allowed to do stents. (Our state only allows hospitals do do certain thngs as a cost cutting move.) These are the charges for transporting:

Ambulance $950
Oxygen $100
EKG $120
Milage (28 miles) $78
The entire process; from pickup to delivery to the second hospital was slightly less than 1 hour.

A. An ambulance costs between $175,000 and $300,000 depending on it's configuration. I know it would never happen but, if that ambulance could be in service 24/7 365 it would generate $9,586,000 per year (Ambulance charge alone.)

B. The hospital called the ambulance company without consulting the family. We had no say in the ambulance company or the costs. (I am a member of the local Voluteer Fire Company.)

C. I checked and have found that there is no agency that regulates the charges that an ambulance company is allowed to charge.

D. This ambulance company does heart related cases only.

[elklindo69]

With all the argument about Obamacare, nobody has any idea what the real market might be for any medical procedure.

What does it cost to take care of x problem? Nobody knows because market forces are filtered through a bunch of billing to health insurance outfits.

A doctor recently persuaded me to have an EKG because I'd never had one and, he said, it was "free" under my insurance. Never mind zero cardiac symptoms. Never mind decades of running outdoors. Naturally, the EKG was normal and a waste of money.

There's no transparency in billing. That's why is costs so much. If any politician drafts a bill requiring an open system, then the hospital lobby will spend a fortune under the guise of "citizens united" to crush it.

The republican supreme court gave us the gift that keeps on giving...

[johnforbes]

Not sure CJ Roberts is a Republican. More like spineless.

The Obamacare ruling dissent, most of which he wrote, noted that the indiv mandate was not in the revenue portion of the bill. And that Obama had gone around the country saying Obamacare was not a tax.

Day after Roberts caved in and let Obamacare by, the White House promptly reiterated that Obamacare was not a tax.

With a spineless person such as Roberts, what does anything matter re the Court?

[Grog]

There's more transparency in hospital charges and billing than most people realize.

Every hospital has what's called a "Chargemaster." It's a listing of procedures and the prices thereof. If you are going to have a planned procedure, call the hospital and tell them you want to know what something is going to cost. Then if there's another hospital in the area, call it or them to compare. Something you'll usually learn real fast is that there's a wide disparity in charges in a small geographical area. Also, they may balk or deny it at first, but a lot of facilities will negotiate.

If you can avoid it, NEVER take an ambulance. As was noted above, it's brutally expensive, they'll take you where they want to go or are contracted with, and frequently, someone can drive you to an emergency room faster than an ambulance call can take.

[RealJustme]

If you are going to have a planned procedure, call the hospital and tell them you want to know what something is going to cost.

If a hospital tells you over the phone what it's going to cost without even examining you, run like hell from that hospital.

[Grog]

Well, JustFreedme, follow your own advice and cancel your wife's insurance policy and pay cash. Whatever they ask at your next medical procedure, demand you pay more.

Clearly, the more you pay, the better care you're getting. Right? Right!

[RealJustme]

Well, JustFreedme, follow your own advice and cancel your wife's insurance policy and pay cash. Whatever they ask at your next medical procedure, demand you pay more.

Clearly, the more you pay, the better care you're getting. Right? Right!

You made my point, by the way you're getting easy.

[Grog]

"You made my point" has become a popular refrain for you, JustFreedme.

What point do you think I made for you?

Thanks in advance.

[RealJustme]

What point do you think I made for you?

Mine.

[Grog]

That's what I figured. You got nothing as always. :lol: