Political discussions about everything
By snakeoil
#12069
“The Fourteen Fundamentals in Following the Prophet.” by Ezra Taft Benson (1899-1994) Past Leader of Mormon Religion. http://www.mrm.org/

In this message, Benson reminded his audience that the Mormon prophet “is the only man who speaks for the Lord in everything,” including “civic matters.” Benson insisted that “those who would remove prophets from politics would take God out of government.” This sermon closed with a stern warning: “The prophet and the presidency—the living prophet and the First Presidency—follow them and be blessed; reject them and suffer.” Wanting to know how a Mormon candidate interprets such comments should not be considered unreasonable.

Would a Mormon in the White House give some legitimacy to Mormonism? Perhaps to a certain extent, though I am not aware of anyone who has changed their views on Mormonism merely because Mitt Romney became governor of Massachusetts or because Harry Reid became a senator in Nevada. Their ability to achieve such positions should not legitimize the claims of Mormonism anymore than Keith Ellison’s (D-MN) election to Congress gives credence to the truth claims of Islam. If nothing else, this is an excellent time for Christians to become better educated with the issues that have long separated Mormonism from Christianity. This includes Christian pastors, many of whom have failed to recognize that the LDS people are a neglected mission field.

Candidate Mitt Romney has always maintained that he would be true to his faith, a faith that is fraught with controversy. Mormonism was founded on the premise that it alone represents true Christianity and that all other professing Christians are part of a “great apostasy.” The Book of Mormon claims that there are only two churches, the church of the Lamb of God and the church of the devil. You can be sure that Mormons certainly do not hold that their church is the latter. Mormon founder Joseph Smith, a man who claimed he saw God, taught that God was once a man, and that faithful Mormons can become Gods in the next life.

A popular couplet in Mormonism states, “As man is, God once was, as God is, man may become.” Mormon leaders have insisted that true salvation ("exaltation," or eternal life), can only be found within Mormonism. Some leaders, such as James Talmage and Spencer W. Kimball, have described the Christian view of salvation by grace through faith as a “pernicious” doctrine “originated by Satan.” Anyone who thinks the Mormon Church is moving towards theological orthodoxy is misinformed.
By snakeoil
#12241
Ezra Taft Benson's 14 Fundamentals:

1. The prophet is the only man who speaks for the Lord in everything.

2. The living prophet is more vital to us than the standard works.

3. The living prophet is more important to us than a dead prophet.

4. The prophet will never lead the church astray.

5. The prophet is not required to have any particular earthly training or credentials to speak on any subject or act on any matter at any time.

6. The prophet does not have to say “Thus Saith the Lord,” to give us scripture.

7. The prophet tells us what we need to know, not always what we want to know.

8. The prophet is not limited by men’s reasoning.

9. The prophet can receive revelation on any matter, temporal or spiritual.

10. The prophet may be involved in civic matters.

11. The two groups who have the greatest difficulty in following the prophet are the proud who are learned and the proud who are rich.

12. The prophet will not necessarily be popular with the world or the worldly.

13. The prophet and his counselors make up the First Presidency—the highest quorum in the Church.

14. The prophet and the presidency—the living prophet and the First Presidency—follow them and be blessed—reject them and suffer.
By BilboBagend
#12242
Typical self aggrandizement and concentration of power. Same as the Pope did when he found he was no longer a secular power ruling over any land. He first positioned himself as the King of Kings with the power to excommunicate. Then he made himself infallible.
By BilboBagend
#12340
I still think that the real secret of Romney's tax returns is that he hasn't been paying his tithe to the LDS and his status is in public jeopardy of embarrassment among his peer Bishops of the church. He is an unrepentant sinner, liar, and cheat.

In other words, when it comes to his church and his faith, he is the same old selfish liar that we all have come to know.

But, that's my personal guess.
By 2X8
#12423
snakeoil wrote:Remember that Romney said that he will always remain true to his faith. Does that mean that the Morman (sic) cult will have the last say in our government?
Better Mitt than a follower of the cult of the 'reverend' Wright.
By snakeoil
#12530
I'm surprised at the lack of discussion on this topic. I feel that Romney should answer this issue once and for all. Ezra Taft Benson's words are official doctrine to the LDS cult.
By BilboBagend
#12531
Romney has answered this questions saying he will act in the interest of the people not accoerdi8ng to church doctrine.

Like everything else he says there is no way to tell. He has and will continue to say anything as any CEO closing a deal will say nearly anything and any cap fin CEO will say anything. He goes to the close and asks his staff, "What do I have to say to close the deal". End of story. He is extremely well practiced in his business world at prevaricating with a straight face.

There is absolutely no way to know or predict what he would do as President. He has no credibility at all. There is not one person on earth who should trust or believe in Mitt Romney other than his family.
By snakeoil
#12888
I really can't understand Romney's support (I'm a Republican.) I have no idea what he stands for; it changes by the hour. Think!

1. How would you be able to do your job if 50% of your fellow employees tried to make sure you fail?

2. You are supposed to vote for the candidate that has the best plan for the country. Romney has been all over the map on his plans.

3. If your place of business was almost totally destroyed, could you rebuild it overnight? Could you with 50% of your fellow employees making sure that you can't do it?

4. Too many people have little idea of the powers of the Presidency. True, the President is supposed to be a leader, but Congress has the power.

5. Many in government thought we'd never get Osama and cut back on the search for him. Obama got him.

6. Romney-Ryan seem to be fostering government by the Christian religious right. How would you feel if another religion was the dominate religion in the U.S.

7. al Queda was a huge threat to the U.S. Obama has decimated it's leadership and effectiveness.

8. Romney's Bain Capital bought Delphi at fire sale prices, forced the government to give it a bailout on the premise of saving U.S. jobs and then closed 24 of the 28 U.S. plants and shipped the jobs to China.

9. Romney's bellicose war talk scares me. I seem to remember that he avoided military service by becoming a Mormon missionary in France. Europe is afraid of him.

10. Romney's tax plan(s) don't make fiscal sense, yet people are buying it.

11. Our forefathers came to this country and remembered what it was like to live under the thumb of the rich, landed gentry. they set up our tax system to prevent a rich, landed elite class in this country.
By snakeoil
#13075
Bloomberg's Businessweek has a fascinating story on how the LDS Church runs various large for-profit businesses - a shopping mall was one of its recent spiritual landmarks. What it helps reveal is something that has continually struck me as I have read more and discovered more about Mormonism: it really is a religion of business for businessmen. Unlike mainstream Christianity, Mormonism sees no conflict between God and Mammon, between the spiritual and the temporal. Making pots of money is part of God's plan. Joseph Smith, a grifter businessman himself, proclaimed conveeeniently that "Verily I say unto you, that all things unto me are spiritual, and not at any time have I given unto you a law which was temporal." By which he meant that there was spiritual glory in capitalism itself - a heresy clearly at odds with almost everything Jesus himself said and taught.

The business starts with mandatory 10 percent tithing if you want access to Temples. All that money - estimated at an annual $8 billion - goes directly to Salt Lake City to a group of powerful businessmen who are the people who run the Church. There is no transparency. Mormons are sometimes charged to go make money for the church in various enterprises (my favorite is a Hawaiian theme-park that pays no taxes because it is related to church activities and yet brings in $60 million a year). Some are even recruited to volunteer services for for-profit enterprises. And the notion of charity is a very Mormon one:

A study co-written by Cragun and recently published in Free Inquiry estimates that the Mormon Church donates only about 0.7 percent of its annual income to charity; the United Methodist Church gives about 29 percent.

http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com ... igion.html
By snakeoil
#13076
Bain Capital under Romney was part of this commercial web:

Mitt Romney and others at Bain Capital, the private equity firm he co-founded in 1984, gave the Mormon Church millions’ worth of stock holdings obtained through Bain deals, according to Reuters. Between 1997 and 2009, these included $2 million in Burger King (BKW) and $1 million in Domino’s Pizza (DPZ) shares. Under U.S. law, churches can legally turn around and sell donated stock without paying capital-gains taxes, a clear advantage for both donor and receiver.

If you were to construct a religion as a business, it would be hard to beat the LDS Church. From its mandatory tithing for access to sacred Temples to its spiritual blessing on business and wealth accumulation and its tax-friendly admixture of for-profit and not-for-profit enterprises, it is the Prosperity Gospel with better accountants. And that makes it the quintessential religion for America - giving the New World a place in the Gospels, bringing the Garden of Eden to Missouri, and providing a divine blessing for American free enterprise. All it needs is a president of the United States to broaden its appeal in a fusion of faith and country. It's been trying since Joseph Smith ran for the highest office in the land - not a typical path for a "spiritual" leader. Now, as the unofficial religion of American capitalism in its least regulated and most rapacious form, it has its chance.

http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com ... igion.html
By snakeoil
#13082
Even though the Mormon church has stopped providing transparency around it’s financial holdings and balance sheets … Bloomberg reports that the Mormon church owns at least the following businesses and many more:

$2 billion megamall in Salt Lake City
A Newspaper
11 radio stations
A TV station
A publishing and distribution company
A digital media company
A hospitality business
An insurance business with assets worth $3.3 billion
1 million acres in the continental U.S.
Properties in Britain, Canada, Australia, Mexico, Argentina, and Brazil worth untold hundreds of millions
7,000 acres on Oahu
Malls
Parking lots
Office parks
Residential buildings
A 42-acre tropical theme park
A business college
11,000 acre hunting preserve
And with ALL of this money … not only does it not have to be shared publicly despite it’s tax shelter status … even regular Mormons have no idea where this money is going. But it doesn’t seem to be going to charity work – according to Bloomberg:

http://www.classwarfareexists.com/how-t ... ing-taxes/
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