[johnforbes]

As the eminent metaphysician Nancy Pelosi might have said, "We had to the start the Obamacare web site to find out what was in it."

[johnforbes]

Good thread.

[sillydaddy]

Obamacare is now out there reeking havoc among Americans.. Obama feels satisfied that the damage is being done, so now he moves on to immigration reform and a farm bill to attack rural America.

[BilboBagend]

https://www.healthcare.gov/find-premium ... cov=family

It took about 60 seconds to answer questions and get the prices for Acadia County, LA.

33 family with wife and children plans available starting at $456 per month without any subsidy.

[BilboBagend]

http://kff.org/interactive/subsidy-calculator/

Here is a test case for Acadia County, LA:

Results
Your State Has Not Decided to Expand Medicaid

States have the option to expand Medicaid coverage to everyone under 138% of the poverty level. If a state expands Medicaid, most of the costs are covered by the federal government under the health reform law. At this time, your state has not decided to expand Medicaid.

Depending on your state’s eligibility criteria, you or some members of your family may still be eligible for Medicaid. Children under the age of 19 at this income are likely eligible for coverage under Medicaid or the Children's Health Insurance Program (CHIP). Contact your state’s Medicaid office or exchange for more information.

Because your income is equal to 106% of the poverty level, you may be eligible for tax credits in the exchanges. Tax credits are only available to people with incomes between 100% and 400% of the poverty level. The information below is about subsidized exchange coverage:

Household income in 2014:
106% of poverty level
Maximum % of income you have to pay for the non-tobacco premium, if eligible for a subsidy:
2%
Health Insurance premium in 2014 (for a silver plan, before tax credit):
$11,055 per year
You could receive a government tax credit subsidy of up to:
$10,555 per year
(which covers 95% of the overall premium)
Amount you pay for the premium:
$500 per year
(which equals 2% of your household income and covers 5% of the overall premium)

Other Levels of Coverage

The premium and subsidy amounts above are based on a Silver plan. You have the option to apply the subsidy toward the purchase of other levels of coverage, such as a Gold plan (which would be more comprehensive) or a Bronze plan (which would be less comprehensive).

For example, you could enroll in a Bronze plan for about $0 per year (which is 0% of your household income). By enrolling in a Bronze plan, you would receive $7,778 in subsidies, which would cover the entire amount of your Bronze premium. For most people, the Bronze plan represents the minimum level of coverage required under health reform. Although you would pay less in premiums by enrolling in a Bronze plan, you will face higher out-of-pocket costs than if you enrolled in a Silver plan.
Out of Pocket Costs

Your out-of-pocket maximum for a Silver plan (not including the premium) can be no more than $4,500. Whether you reach this maximum level will depend on the amount of health care services you use. Currently, about one in four people use no health care services in any given year.

You are guaranteed access to a Silver plan with an actuarial value of 94%. This means that for all enrollees in a typical population, the plan will pay for 94% of expenses in total for covered benefits, with enrollees responsible for the rest. If you choose to enroll in a Bronze plan, the actuarial value will be 60%, meaning your out-of-pocket costs when you use services will likely be higher. Regardless of which level of coverage you choose, deductibles and copayments will vary from plan to plan, and out-of-pocket costs will depend on your health care expenses. Preventive services will be covered with no cost sharing required.
Other Coverage Options

Children and young adults under age 30 are eligible to purchase catastrophic coverage. With a catastrophic plan, you would pay out-of-pocket for most health services until you reach the annual limit on cost sharing ($12,700 in 2014). However, preventive services are covered with no cost sharing required.

Children under the age of 19 may also be eligible for coverage under Medicaid or the Children's Health Insurance Program (CHIP), depending on your state's eligibility requirements.

[BilboBagend]

Oh, that took another 3 minutes.

[johnforbes]

Looking at a bronze plan, 60 percent of cost covered, how is that affordable?

And, if you can get a subsidy with a family of 4 and an income of up to 94k, how does the financing make any sense?

Isn't the taxpayer going to have to pony up many more trillions for this?

[sillydaddy]

Obviously Bilbo doesn't see himself as a taxpayer. The government can't give anything, it doesn't first take from someone else.

[sillydaddy]

Obviously Bilbo doesn't see himself as a taxpayer. The government can't give anything, it doesn't first take from someone else.

[BilboBagend]

Very good silly shit. Every dollar that any government spends comes from taxpayers. Always has.

The very nature of any government is either socialism for the people or theft by people in positions of power.

Any rational person wants to stop the part where people in positions of power steal from the people. Like corporate subsidies through the tax code and grants to powerful already wealthy businesses.

The ONLY legitimate function of government is to protect and support the well being of the people. Encouraging entrepreneurs and new science and technologies does that. Paying out to wealthy corporations and providing special rules to enrich large corporations is the opposite of that. Insulating large corporations from their legal liabilities is the opposite of supporting the people. It is corporatism (fascism), supporting corporations (and their wealthy executives and principles) at great expense to the people.

It's all clear in the macroeconomics. More concentration of wealth (corporatism). Smaller less affluent middle class (corporatism). Larger poverty class (corporatism).

Let's run government for the people, not against the people.

Let's run government for freedom and equality of the the people, not against the people in support of religious fundamentalism, bigotry, racism, and autocracy.

[johnforbes]

Look at education today, with kindergarten and Head Start.

Now the Obama folks want something earlier than that.

Liberals have zero faith in individuals or the family, but instead they have this naive faith in bureaucracy, as if some School Board were better equipped to raise a child.

[RealJustme]

Bilbo- Very good silly shit. Every dollar that any government spends comes from taxpayers. Always has.

That used to be the case until Obama came along, it's not true that every dollar he's spending is coming from taxpayers, over 6 trillion of the money Obama has spent came from foreign Countries who we will have to pay back. I don't believe Chinese or Japanese pay US taxes.

[BilboBagend]

Oh, you mean the borrowing that is required because Republicans decided to be fiscally irresponsible and lower taxes without lower spending, starting huge long term unfunded wars, expanding spending by subsidizing wealthy people through the tax code, etc. Ok, we all know about that.

Still, the only legitimate functions of government are still socialism, and only socialism.

[johnforbes]

The "It's Bush's Fault" theme has gotten tedious.

Obama promised a lot, and each and every promise he made about Obamacare has been broken.

It was not arrived at openly.

It was not bipartisan.

Millions can't keep their doctor, or health plan, and costs will go up -- not down.