[snakeoil]

https://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2020/0 ... ef=d-river

But then again it's just a Democratic hoax. It will suddenly disappear. No cause for panic.

[snakeoil]

To Dump's credit, we haven't heard him say that he knows more about the corona virus than the doctors.

The greatest slam to Dumpty would be o have a Chinese virus named after a Mexican beer and have a cure found by an illegal alien.

[johnforbes]

All the politicians, from Obama to Cuomo to Trump to deBlasio, were slow off the mark.

But they were not physicians.

Fauci said on Feb 17 that the coronavirus risk was "minuscule."

On March 30, the WHO said there was no evidence masks helped.

On March 31, our Surgeon General said masks were not needed.

[Clownkicker]

So apparently johnfornes' advice is to not listen to medical professionals.

But then, johnforbes is one of those still believing this will miraculously disappear in April.

Didn't I tell you, johnny, April is the cruelest month. Predictably, you shrugged it off.

[snakeoil]

https://apnews.com/ce014d94b64e98b7203b873e56f80e9a

The NSC during the Obama administration grew to about 250 professionals, according to Trump’s current national security adviser, Robert O’Brien. The staff has been cut to about 110 or 115 staffers, he said.

Code: Select all

[quote]For many years, the national intelligence director’s worldwide threat assessment has warned that a flu pandemic or other large-scale outbreak of a contagious disease could lead to massive rates of death and disability that would severely affect the world economy. Public health experts have been blowing whistles too.[/quote]

Back in mid-2018, Fauci told Congress: “When you have a respiratory virus that can be spread by droplets and aerosol and ... there’s a degree of morbidity associated with that, you can have a catastrophe. ... The one that we always talk about is the 1918 pandemic, which killed between 50 and 100 million people. ... Influenza first, or something like influenza, is the one that keeps me up at night.”

Former Obama administration officials insist that the Trump White House would have been able to act more quickly had the office still been intact.

“I think if we’d had a unit and dedicated professionals looking at this issue, gaming out scenarios well before ... we might have identified some of these testing issues,” says Lisa Monaco, President Obama’s homeland security adviser, said at a recent forum on coronavirus. “There would have been folks sounding the alarm in December when we saw this coming out of China, saying ’Hey, what do we need to be doing here in this country to address it?”

Ron Klain, who managed the government response to contain and mitigate the spread of Ebola in 2014, agreed.

“If I were back in my old job at the White House ... I’d be pushing to have us do 30 million tests — to test people in nursing homes, to test people with unexplained respiratory ailments, to test the people who regularly visit nursing homes, to test healthcare workers,” Klain said recently at the event hosted by the Center for American Progress in Washington.

It's getting harder and harder to make excuses for Dumpty isn't it John.

[sillydaddy]

Back in January the Demos and liberals were too busy trying to get Trump kicked out of office...
If Trump had said we need to prepare for a coming pendamic now brewing in China...
He would have been accused of deflecting from the "real" issues facing him..!
But now, even Fauci says that if a vaccine is developed in 18 months it will be the fastest time ever for a vaccine..!
So Clown, snake...quit your bitchin' and get with the program..!

[elklindo69]

So Silly....how many times did Trump go golfing and how many rallies did he have in January 2020?

[johnforbes]

Democrats were frantic to locate any issue to run senile handsy Biden on, so perhaps they will have to settle for coronavirus.

But I didn't condemn Obama, or Cuomo, or deBlasio much because they are not doctors and thus couldn't be expected to be up to speed on this virus.

All the politicians, from Obama to Cuomo to Trump to deBlasio, were slow off the mark.

But they were not physicians.

Fauci, in between emailing Cheryl Mills to express his admiration and "love" for Hillary, said on Feb 17 that the coronavirus risk was "minuscule."

On March 30, the WHO said there was no evidence masks helped.

On March 31, our Surgeon General said masks were not needed.

[Clownkicker]

So again, apparently johnforbes' advice is to not listen to any medical professionals.

Okay, let's all do that.






Or are you saying we shouldn't listen to any Trump Administration Republican Senate confirmed appointees?

Sure, let's all do that, right, johnny?

[RealJustme]

All the politicians, from Obama to Cuomo to Trump to deBlasio, were slow off the mark.

They were not only slow off the mark they also claimed Trump was being over reactive and racist when he banned Chinese from coming in after Coronavirus broke out in China. That act by Trump should make him Time's person of the year for saving untold 100's of thousands of American lives. Books will be written about how one man saved so many lives by making such a brave move despite federal judges and Democrats trying to stop him from making it.

[Clownkicker]

^^^^^^ Zzziiinnnngggggg! Right over his dimwitted head.

It would help so much if he could just read English.

[sillydaddy]

So Silly....how many times did Trump go golfing and how many rallies did he have in January 2020?

As many as he wanted....much to your disappointment, he's still President..!

[snakeoil]

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... c-response

President Donald Trump’s failure to respond to the coronavirus pandemic didn’t begin with the administration’s inability to send out the millions of test kits and the protective medical gear for health care workers that experts say are needed to tackle the crisis. It didn’t start with Trump’s bungled messaging downplaying the crisis even as it’s worsened, nor with his mid-March insistence that social distancing measures could be lifted by Easter (he later backpedaled).

It began in April 2018 — more than a year and a half before the SARS-CoV-2 virus and the disease it causes, Covid-19, sickened enough people in China that authorities realized they were dealing with a new disease.

The Trump administration, with John Bolton newly at the helm of the White House National Security Council, began dismantling the team in charge of pandemic response, firing its leadership and disbanding the team in spring 2018.

The cuts, coupled with the administration’s repeated calls to cut the budget for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and other public health agencies, made it clear that the Trump administration wasn’t prioritizing the federal government’s ability to respond to disease outbreaks.

But experts say a lot of the damage has been done: The federal government is still only playing catch-up, as thousands of new cases of coronavirus are confirmed and the death toll steadily increases every day.

The first sign of a massive failure came with testing. South Korea, which has been widely praised for its response to coronavirus, tested more than 66,000 people within a week of the first community transmission within its borders. By comparison, the US took roughly three weeks to complete that many tests — in a country that is much more populous and, now, is on track to have a much worse outbreak than South Korea and other nations.

Testing is crucial to slowing epidemics. First, it lets public health officials identify sick people and subsequently isolate them. Second, they can trace that sick person’s recent contacts to make sure those people aren’t sick and to get them into quarantine as well. It’s one of the best tools we have for an outbreak like this.

But it’s the kind of thing that the Trump administration has screwed up, while instead trying to downplay the threat of Covid-19. Trump himself has tweeted comparisons of Covid-19 to the common flu — which Jha describes as “really unhelpful,” because the novel coronavirus appears to be much worse. Trump also called concerns about the virus a “hoax.” He said on national television that, based on nothing more than a self-admitted “hunch,” the death rate of the disease is much lower than public health officials projected.

Trump’s failures began years ago

When Bolton became Trump’s national security adviser in 2018, he quickly moved to disband the White House National Security Council’s Directorate for Global Health Security and Biodefense, which President Barack Obama set up after the 2014-2016 Ebola outbreak to lead federal coordination and preparation for disease outbreaks.

In April 2018, Bolton fired Tom Bossert, then the homeland security adviser, who, the Washington Post reported, “had called for a comprehensive biodefense strategy against pandemics and biological attacks.” Then, that May, Bolton let go the head of pandemic response, Rear Adm. Timothy Ziemer, and his global health security team. The team, the Directorate for Global Health Security and Biodefense, was never replaced.

At the time, the Trump administration and Bolton argued the cuts were needed to streamline the National Security Council.

But, according to experts, the work of a global health security team, or something like it, is crucial to responding to any disease outbreak. Since the federal government is sprawling and large, it helps to have centralized leadership in case of a crisis. That leadership could ensure all federal agencies are doing the most they can and working toward a single set of goals.

But it’s important to have this kind of agency set up before an outbreak. Setting up an agency takes time; it requires hiring staff, handing out tasks and expected workloads, creating internal policies, and so on. A preexisting agency is also going to have plans worked out before an outbreak, with likely contingencies in place for what to do. That’s why it was so important to have this agency in place even during years, like 2018, when disease pandemics didn’t seem like a nearby threat to everyone.

“The basic systems need to be in place for global, state, and local responses,” Jen Kates, a senior vice president and director of global health and HIV policy at the Kaiser Family Foundation, told me. “When you don’t shore those up, you’re not starting from scratch, but you’re catching up every single time.”

By repeatedly undercutting outbreak preparedness, Jha said, the Trump administration signaled “to the government and all the agencies this is not a priority. And that means that even other agencies end up not putting as much attention and energy on it. So I think this has been a longstanding problem of the White House.”

Trump, for his part, has defended his record, arguing, “I’m a businessperson. I don’t like having thousands of people around when you don’t need them. When we need them, we can get them back very quickly.”

But experts argue that’s not how pandemic preparedness should work. “You build a fire department ahead of time,” Tom Inglesby, director of the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security, told the Washington Post. “You don’t wait for a fire.

[johnforbes]

But Snake, much of that is mere partisan nonsense.

In a technical way, Obama was to blame for allowing his flu crisis to spin into a genuine problem, and so was Cuomo, and deBlasio, and Trump too.

We seldom elect doctors as politicians.

In this case, though, is Dr Fauci a genius or an idiot? After all, Fauci said Feb 17 that the coronavirus threat was minuscule, you could go to the Super Bowl, and masks were not needed.

On March 30, WHO said you don't need masks.

On March 31, the Surgeon General said masks were not needed or useful.

The Imperial College London model said 2.2 million Americans could die. Totally wrong, and its author Ferguson now says so.

The other models were totally wrong too, so listening to Fauci and Birx did harm first to the economy and in the end we probably won't even have the 80,000 dead America had in the 2017-18 flu.

[elklindo69]

Johnnie...Trump claimed that only 15 people would get this disease...tops... and it would all go away like a miracle.

And now Trump is claiming victory and taking a lap after claiming that only 100,000 people would die?

[johnforbes]

When Trump said only a few people would die, he was wrong.

He isn't a doctor.

When Fauci and Birx adopted the crazy Imperial College estimate, they were claiming 2.2 million Americans could die of coronavirus.

As doctors, they were pretty nutty to believe that.

So now America has 16,000 coronavirus deaths, plus 10,000 earlier flu deaths before all this, and it is shaping up as just another flu year with 30k lost.

[Clownkicker]

"When Trump said only a few people would die, he was wrong.
He isn't a doctor."-johnflubs

And yet he practices medicine without a license prescribing unapproved medicine to Americans in his public addresses, telling us in so many words to "Take it." And he advises Americans on medical matters based on his "hunch."

You always want it both ways. You want to absolve Trump of blame because he's not a doctor, but you don't hold him responsible for his criminal behaviors of practicing medicine without a license.


"So now America has 16,000 coronavirus deaths, plus 10,000 earlier flu deaths before all this, and it is shaping up as just another flu year with 30k lost."-johnfoibles

That you can't understand that the only reason the mortality rate is this low is because the economy was shut down to allow people to keep social distance. When the shutdown proves mercifully effective, you will still hold up the low death count as proof there was an "overreaction" instead of realizing it is proof that social distancing worked and was necessary.

[johnforbes]

Trump suggested that HCQ might work, and he many times said it might not.

He was NOT practicing medicine, but attempting to save lives.

What a shame Fauci would like perfect science more than he would like to save lives today, which HCQ is apparently doing.

The reality is that Fauci may have some link to Big Pharma and know that not much money will be made off cheap old HCQ.

So the point I'm making, even as an investor who likes money, is the point Democrats should be making if they really cared about virus victims.

[Clownkicker]

"Trump suggested that HCQ might work, and he many times said it might not.
He was NOT practicing medicine, but attempting to save lives."-johnfibs

And then he said "Take it. What have you got to lose" That is absolutely practicing medicine without a license.
Ask anyone in law enforcement and they will tell you "attempting to save lives" is not a defense against the crime. It never has been. Your saying it does only proves you never went to law school. (At least in any meaningful way. You think the law is whatever lame rhetoric you choose to deploy this week.)

"What a shame Fauci would like perfect science more than he would like to save lives today, which HCQ is apparently doing."-johnfibs

He doesn't want "perfect science" dimwit. He wants something that is recognized as "science" at all.

"But to describe such a population of patients as going home and saying, “There were very few hospitalizations and it is going well,” does not in any way prove that the treatment reduces hospitalizations."-Benjamin Davido, MD, an infectious disease specialist at Raymond-Poincaré Hospital in Garches, Paris

johnforbes STILL needs to learn that "correlation is not causation."


"The reality is that Fauci may have some link to Big Pharma..."-johnfoibles

The reality is that johnforbes' speculation about Fauci's possible "link to Big Pharma" is not an argument for using HCQ any more than it is an argument that Trump has a possible link to Big Pharma that makes the drug he has been prescribing. But Trump's real drug pushing is unsupported by science, where Fauci's rational caution IS scientific.

""...not much money will be made off cheap old HCQ."-johnfibs

Don't kid yourself, dummy. BILLIONS OF DOLLARS would be made off "cheap old HCQ" if it were prescribed globally for this pandemic. You're stupid, but even I can't believe you're THAT stupid.
"not much money"--Criminy, does your partisan dishonesty have no limits at all?

[johnforbes]

Oh, come on, a president saying "What do you have to lose?" about an overall situation is very, very different from practicing medicine.

But the sad thing is that Trump has added value in urging consideration of HCQ, and Fauci has added NOTHING by turning up his nose at HCQ while being too lazy to start his own clinical trial of it.

[Clownkicker]

Oh, come on, a president saying "Take it." about a specific drug he knows nothing about is criminal. He's talking to millions of people and predictably, just like with the fish tank cleaner lady, someone (or perhaps many people) is going to take him at his word and take the drug.

And then you will be back here mewling that there's no way anyone could have predicted someone in America would follow Trump's explicit directions. You'll insist that Trump is not responsible for people doing what he explicitly told them to do. How could anyone see that coming?

Unsurprisingly, that's the same defense Trump uses with the entire Administration. Despite the fact that Obama officials walked Trump aides through a global pandemic exercise in 2017, and in 2017 and 2018 threat assessments analysts mentioned a close cousin of coronavirus by name, saying it had "pandemic potential." And in 2018 the director for medical and biodefense preparedness at the NSC told a symposium that "the threat of pandemic flu is our number-one health security concern." And last year administration officials said the threat of a pandemic kept them up at night. Last year White House economists warned that a pandemic could devastate America. And an iIntelligence report warned of coronavirus crisis as early as last November. And U.S. intelligence reports in January and February warned about a likely pandemic, what is Trump's response? "Nobody could see it coming."-Trump " It was completely unexpected"-Trump "I don't take any responsibility for it."-Trump

Flat out lies-- This it the kind of 'leadership' johnforbes is whining on about. He actually thinks nothing is Trump's fault and that he shouldn't be held accountable for his disastrous decisions like failing to read intelligence briefings and shutting down the White House pandemic response office two years ago.

Oh, come on, johnny. Stop giving Trump credit for adding "value" (whatever the fuck THAT is supposed to mean) to medical malpractice with prescribing("Take it.") HCQ without a license. And he was finally forced to reverse his idiotic and indefensible proposed cut to Federal funding for virus testing. Trump was actually going to cut it until someone convinced him how bad it would look if he did.

But hey, "Nobody could see it coming" right, so what could anyone expect Trump to do?

Geezus, johnny, you are one dumb partisan motherfucker. Wake up, fer cripes sake.

[elklindo69]

Now John Forbes wants to get us to believe that we are supposed to take medical advise from someone who thinks that windmills cause cancer....

This is the lunacy permeating from Trumplandia.

[johnforbes]

Medical input is one piece of this puzzle, but obviously ALL of the medical models were WRONG, WRONG, WRONG.

Fauci said America could not reopen until there are no new cases, but that is lunacy.

Over 2 million Americans die every year of various causes.

The fish tank should be investigated for crime, and it is a crime how wrong Elkin is as well.

In fact, Elkin and Clown are two the very few individuals in this great land who might actually elevate their IQs by drinking some such substance.